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Female Pelvic Examinations without Patient Consent
  • lindade
    Posts: 66Member

    My DSIL always keeps me informed of all freminine issues. Here are the links she sent me regarding examinations performed in Canada and the US.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/health/new-health/health-news/pelvic-exams-without-consent-still-possible-under-new-guidelines-report/article2381557/

    http://www.madisonmag.com.au/news/no-consent-patients-probed-by-medical-students.htm

    http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=125094&page=1

    In the past I had undergone various female procedures which required me to be under general anesthesia. I dred the thought of young students using my privates as teaching tools. Like DSIL says, most university hospitals have 'Model Patients', that are used as real models for examinations. I wonder how many women are aware of this? 

  • pennypenny
    Posts: 796Member
    I wasn't until now. You know, I don't necessarily have a problem serving in that capacity. But if I found out it had been done without my consent, I would be livid. There is no excuse for such a blatant lack of respect for the patient.
  • ZidashaZidasha
    Posts: 830Member
    Ummmm...I'm all for being practiced on as far as that's concerned cause I know students need to learn and doctors won't let students practice on real people unless they do well on the fakes (One would hope anyway)  After all, while in the Navy I was a practice dummy for new corpman when it came to getting blood drawn, shots, getting swabbed for strep, and I even consented once to a new doctor to do a pap.  when I had my first I had to have a C-section so I was asked permission if a new doctor could do the procedure with the experienced one right there.  

    That's the thing tho, I was informed and asked every time.  If I found out it was done without my consent I'd sue, of course unless the student is willing to come forward and admit to it you have no real proof.


    "I have a theory that placenta is brain matter I push out, so with each child I get dumber and dumber." ~ Unknown

  • AnonUser31
    Posts: 327Guest
    The last time I went in for a pap the doctor had a med student in training for (residency I think) and asked if the doctor could examine me after my doctor examined me. I said yes. It was awkward to say the least, but now I can say I helped someone to become a doctor! ;) lol
  • LA_PygmyHerderLA_PygmyHerder
    Posts: 1,239Member

    Being used and veiwed by students without your consent is a violation of HIPPA laws. It is a violation of patient privacy. The attending physician is supposed to ask and have you sign a consent waiver before hand unless it is a teaching hospital, in which case, the consent form is in with all other paperwork.

  • primalmommaprimalmomma
    Posts: 1,137Member
    LA_PygmyHerder said:

    Being used and veiwed by students without your consent is a violation of HIPPA laws. It is a violation of patient privacy. The attending physician is supposed to ask and have you sign a consent waiver before hand unless it is a teaching hospital, in which case, the consent form is in with all other paperwork.



    I'm just curious where in the HIPPA laws it says this specific thing is illegal.  Cuz I'm confused, the article says there's no law?  

    I'm thinking of mentioning something anytime I'm knocked out! That was actually a fear of mine when I got my wisdom teeth pulled.  They would have their way with me!! Scary!! 

    I don't mind helping and I've done it before for a Pap - was asked, well after the students (yup, multiple students!!) were in the room AND my lady bits were already exposed.  I was more of, "might as well, you just saw it all."  Would kinda piss me off now they way they asked AFTER they were already in there, but I was 22 and not strong enough to say "uh no, ask before you see my coochy next time"  ....man, but then to have them be all sneaky when you're unconscious!!  huge violation!!
    “I did then what I knew to do. Now that I know better, I do better.” (Maya Angelou)
    http://www.primalmomma.com
  • AnonUser26
    Posts: 1,161Guest
    Any consent, ANY consent you sign at a teaching hospital (not all teaching hospitals are public, the one I work for is private and not associated with a particular university, but being the largest facility where we live, they offer med student internships and residency programs) has a clause in it that you agree to be treated or at minimum observed by nursing and medical students. You should ALWAYS fully read your consents. HIPPA only covers release of information. The "consent for treatment" covers medical and nursing students, also that other procedures may or may not be preformed at the attending physicians DISCRETION. As a RN, I have helped hundreds of patients understand informed consent. I'm not saying it's right, but that's how it is. It is well within your right to have this amended when you sign the consent. The more you know. :D
  • pdxmama
    Posts: 1,489Member
    @FinallyFree2BMe is absolutely right about consents. HIPPA wouldn't actually have anything to do with something like this. It's about privacy practices and patients' personal information, (how said information is collected, processes for releasing it, etc.) not anything having to with treatment.
  • DaBOMB
    Posts: 275Member
    I have had many procedures observered by staff in training. Even had an intern there for most of my labor. She was in and out... but my doc thought it was important for this poor girl who had never had a baby observe from start to finish what a woman goes through. I was asked if I was ok with that. But only because I was introduced and awake to give consent. Labor is a private thing. And there were a couple of times where I just needed my husband and no one else. She would step out when ever we asked. But my consent form was to be treated by the hospital. As long as the person is qualified I'm not sure what the big deal is. When I went in passed out and had an emergency d&c performed... they didn't wait for me to wake up... dh signed the forms and they saved my life. I had never even met the doc that did it. Okey dokey. They're a doctor. Or a nurse. Its not like they had the cafeteria lady looking at my vag!
  • Katescrazymom
    Posts: 1,848Member
    I had a student midwife working with mine with ds, and she was great during labour. But, I was asked.
    Doing anything not required while a patient is unconscious is so wrong.
  • irishlassirishlass
    Posts: 6,757Member
    Without consent?? That's just wrong. When I was pregnant I refused for a med student to be present at one exam, because of the potential that I went to school with them. I know there were 3 girls and I didn't want to take that risk when I was feeling so vulnerable. I've let students stitch me up/ take blood, but I was feeling vulnerable.
    "Be who you are and say what you feel. Because those who matter don't mind and those who mind don't matter." - Dr. Seuss
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